mike1379 Posted November 16, 2018 Report Share Posted November 16, 2018 On 11/14/2018 at 3:19 PM, CuriousNow said: YES - that's essentially what I was trying to say! And I totally agree that if we made nudity less taboo (as a society) it would really help reduce "sexual" bullying and just bullying in general, I think. I have long been an advocate of "clothing optional" family life, too, for similar reasons. If kids grow up seeing family members nude, be they siblings, parents, uncles, aunts, cousins, grandparents...., it all becomes completely natural, unremarkable and unsensational. So while some teens (or pre-teens) might get themselves into dangerous situations solely because they were driven by a fierce curiosity to see another person naked (same or opposite gender), a child who has seen boys and girls, teens and adults of both genders, all throughout his or her life would not be so driven. Sure, there would still be curiosity about how a particular individual might look, but I do believe that the drive *I* felt to see a girl, any girl, naked would be greatly reduced if not completely eliminated. I'm not saying families should always be nude at home (although that's an option if they so choose), but that if a family member happens to be undressed while going to or from the shower, or maybe skinny dipping in the pool - or just changing their clothes, why keep it all hidden like some forbidden or dirty secret thing. The human body in all its variations is an awesome thing to behold. Let children learn that early in their lives and prevent problems later. That's my take on it. Uh... sorry, got off on a rant and off topic a bit... I agree with you. Unfortunately so many people in the US have intense phobias about nudity, especially within the family. I've found Europeans much more open and casual about nudity at home and at the beach. I found it liberating. I did grow up taking showers every day with my father until I was almost 12. My brother and I often showered together at home when we were young teens. Group showers at school started when I was 10 or so....I was very curious about other boys, I think we all were but never encountered any bullying at that age. I don't think cock size became noticeable until I was in high school. Triasco9.5, Vinnig, Biggie Smalls and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Scott Posted November 16, 2018 Report Share Posted November 16, 2018 Being or feeling superior to another may come from a certain trait or size of a body part when we are young and immature because we have a lot to learn whilst young. When we mature we realise that superiority comes from respect and respect has to be earned, it's never given! Being or feeling superior to another in adulthood either comes from position of power which is not always earned thus false superiority. Or alternatively conducting yourself through life properly, working hard and earning a position of power and using that power responsibly whilst respecting everyone around you. Thats true superiority but only in a positional sense, never does a physical trait make one superior except in the world of some sports. To think otherwise is usually due to low self esteem. You are and can be just as superior as anyone else with the right mindset. Vinnig 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck45 Posted November 17, 2018 Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) @Triasco9.5 My point was if you think they are "superior", then they are. Ancient greeks thought smaller is superior, now bigger is. It can't be both ways. As you said, perception.. and perceptions change (obviously). Its not their penis size, it my/yours/our self-esteem that is the issue. Our perception of superiority is skewed. Perceptions and erroneous beliefs to often go hand in hand Some still believe men are superior to women..... There are advantages/disadvantages to either end of the spectrum. Edited November 17, 2018 by canuck45 old n hard, Vinnig, Red Scott and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 18, 2018 Report Share Posted November 18, 2018 On 11/16/2018 at 10:04 AM, canuck45 said: @overthehill For someone who rants about using the term "average range", I am surprised you would use "normal" size and "normally" timed. What is normal size and normally timed? And I disagree that they feel superior. That is perhaps your projection of feeling inferior. As for "they are superior", hogwash. dick size makes for superiority / certain traits make a superior human..... whats next, eye colour, skin colour and hair colour. Normal range is a correct concept though subject to abuse. Average is not. Normal refers to the statistically prevalent. You can choose whatever % you want to define normal, but a range that contains less than 50% would make little sense. I have not been ranting, only correcting ignorance of statistics. A 1" erection is inferior for penetration sex with most females. A long delayed puberty is inferior for teenage dating. Comparing functional organs to eye color, skin colour, and hair colour is just a senseless smear, not a good argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck45 Posted November 19, 2018 Report Share Posted November 19, 2018 @overthehill whatever...... and yes you do rant.....everyone understands the difference between average ( a single number) and what is meant by average range and you go on and on and on..... YOUR BEATING A DEAD HORSE. You repeat the same thing on average at least 8-10 times, Red Scott and Curious52 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sed275 Posted November 19, 2018 Report Share Posted November 19, 2018 Personally I’ve been around average since I was like 15. But that was also more than 20 years ago. It seems a lot of boys/teens are developing really big really quick nowadays. I posted a story here not to long ago about a 14 year old nudist who must’ve been 9” erect. It was definitely bizarre. I’m not going to be a fool and say that that boy was the new average for teens, but judging from my experiences and from stories I’ve read it’s much more common for kids to grow over average size even by the begining of puberty. Vinnig and Triasco9.5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 19, 2018 Report Share Posted November 19, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, canuck45 said: @overthehill whatever...... and yes you do rant.....everyone understands the difference between average ( a single number) and what is meant by average range and you go on and on and on..... YOUR BEATING A DEAD HORSE. You repeat the same thing on average at least 8-10 times, As do those insisting on the opposite to minimize the issues of actually being small. Those in the high normal range for a decade now want to minimize the issues of those in low normal, projecting their dysmorphia on the actually small. Edited November 19, 2018 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curious52 Posted November 19, 2018 Report Share Posted November 19, 2018 11 hours ago, overthehill said: Those in the high normal range for a decade now want to minimize the issues of those in low normal, projecting their dysmorphia on the actually small. @overthehill: I would like to know what and where you found the studies for this response, or is this your personal opinion. I cannot find any studies or surveys to justify this response. I believe everyone has a right to an opinion; and to belittle someones opinion, belittles the persons credibility that is criticizing said opinion. Triasco9.5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 20, 2018 Report Share Posted November 20, 2018 19 hours ago, Curious52 said: @overthehill: I would like to know what and where you found the studies for this response, or is this your personal opinion. I cannot find any studies or surveys to justify this response. I believe everyone has a right to an opinion; and to belittle someones opinion, belittles the persons credibility that is criticizing said opinion. I've been on this formum for over a decade. I was talking about THIS FORUM. Pretty sure there are no studies. It was necessary to set-up a below 4.5" because of this issue. At one point, the argument got nasty. Really small guys were angry about having their issues dismissed. Belittle? Just arguing my opinion vs. others. My argument is with the group think tendency I see here. It seems to be a natural phenomenon, though, not something peculiar to Measurection, though. So, I guess it is also based on my personal informal "study" here and in other forums. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 20, 2018 Report Share Posted November 20, 2018 On 11/16/2018 at 4:10 PM, Red Scott said: Being or feeling superior to another may come from a certain trait or size of a body part when we are young and immature because we have a lot to learn whilst young. When we mature we realise that superiority comes from respect and respect has to be earned, it's never given! Being or feeling superior to another in adulthood either comes from position of power which is not always earned thus false superiority. Or alternatively conducting yourself through life properly, working hard and earning a position of power and using that power responsibly whilst respecting everyone around you. Thats true superiority but only in a positional sense, never does a physical trait make one superior except in the world of some sports. To think otherwise is usually due to low self esteem. You are and can be just as superior as anyone else with the right mindset. Seems to me you are conflating overall superiority with superiority in a a particular. Yes, we are all created equal in a moral sense. I am inferior, however, to Lebron James for the sport of basketball. I am inferior to some with some women for penetrative sex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggie Smalls Posted November 21, 2018 Report Share Posted November 21, 2018 On 11/19/2018 at 12:20 PM, overthehill said: As do those insisting on the opposite to minimize the issues of actually being small. Those in the high normal range for a decade now want to minimize the issues of those in low normal, projecting their dysmorphia on the actually small. You're talking about a high normal range and a low medium range. Is there a medium normal range as well? There must be because those slightly below average cannot really be distinguished by the naked eye from those slightly above average. So the experience in everyday life should be the same. Curious52 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triasco9.5 Posted November 21, 2018 Report Share Posted November 21, 2018 Although the current discussion is interesting in its own right, I think it goes without saying that it is a bit off topic with the thread it's in. Perhaps it would be better to create another thread to discussion these issues of perception of size and the minimizing of the experiences of others, both of which are valid points. I apologize if anyone, including myself, have made you feel as though we're disregarding the experiences you have lived, overthehill. And I extend that apology from myself to the others here as well. Let's save the debate for a more fitting thread. Curious52 and Nillywilly 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2018 Report Share Posted November 22, 2018 12 hours ago, Triasco9.5 said: Although the current discussion is interesting in its own right, I think it goes without saying that it is a bit off topic with the thread it's in. Perhaps it would be better to create another thread to discussion these issues of perception of size and the minimizing of the experiences of others, both of which are valid points. I apologize if anyone, including myself, have made you feel as though we're disregarding the experiences you have lived, overthehill. And I extend that apology from myself to the others here as well. Let's save the debate for a more fitting thread. No apology needed for different perspectives and opinions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2018 Report Share Posted November 22, 2018 On 11/16/2018 at 11:45 AM, mike1379 said: I found it liberating. I did grow up taking showers every day with my father until I was almost 12. I remember being forced to shower with my father as a toddler. It made me very uncomfortable more due to being at eye level with his privates. I don't recall size being an issue in my mind, but he wasn't very big. I was more put-off by his discussing each time of the importance of washing the penis and showing me how. For some reason, he could never grasp that washing is a non-issue for circumsized guys. He was a blockhead on the issue. I remember complaining, finally, to my mother and the joint showering stopped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2018 Report Share Posted November 22, 2018 @Triasco9.5 Ah! OK, I understand. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2018 Report Share Posted November 22, 2018 On 11/16/2018 at 5:08 AM, overthehill said: I recently posted my experience with group showers in another thread, I think. I let it mess up my whole life. I disagree entirely, Familiarity breeds contempt. Guys who have normal genital size and a normally timed puberty feel superior to guys dramatically lacking in these 2 areas because they are superior. I will look for your post in the other thread. As for your view about whether a given group of boys would be better served seeing each other naked earlier on in life; whether that would make them less likely to be cruel to one another - your experience cannot be denied. I believe in some ways, I was very lucky. This was in part due to being a year older than my classmates in three of those early ("puberty-ripe") years, but possibly more so due to the fact that, with one exception, I really never saw any abuse of other boys. Maybe I just got lucky. I've read so many posts from guys who observed or suffered from verbal or physical abuse due to late puberty or slower genital development (or both), that I will agree that, in many cases, what you said is true - "familiarity breeds contempt." Perhaps it's in most cases. I may have been lucky. I may have been unobservant. Such abuse just was not part of my "growing up." I'm sorry that it was part of yours - and so many others. I'd like to think that this forum is a place where at least some of the pain of such experiences can be dissipated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2018 Report Share Posted November 22, 2018 On 11/16/2018 at 10:45 AM, mike1379 said: I did grow up taking showers every day with my father until I was almost 12. My brother and I often showered together at home when we were young teens. Group showers at school started when I was 10 or so....I was very curious about other boys, I think we all were but never encountered any bullying at that age. I don't think cock size became noticeable until I was in high school. Responding to the quoted points... My father was somewhat casual about nudity - my brother and I saw him naked from time to time, typically before or after a shower; the point being that while he didn't spend a lot of time nude around us, he made no effort to hide it from us. I never saw my mother nude in person (although I did find a nude photo of her once). And other than one "traumatic" (at the time) incident when I was 12, she never saw me naked after I started dressing myself. Not sure if she saw my brother (or vice versa). My brother and I never showered together, but for the better part of a year, whenever we were alone at home, we were naked (I've posted about that before). But the part of your post that intrigued me was the statement about "never encountered any bullying at that age" (those early school showers). I recently responded to @overthehillwhose experience was not like yours or mine. I am coming to the belief that you and I may have been in the minority (in that we rarely, if ever, encountered abuse in the locker rooms/showers). Also, your mention of European families being much more open and casual about nudity - I completely agree; I was an exchange student in Europe for a short time and the family with which I lived (with no less than nine children, eight of which were still at home), while they either didn't go around the house nude (or they did but hid that while I was with them), they were completely comfortable around each other in the nude when I wasn't around. How would I know? While staying at a grandfather's very old (mid-1800s I'd guess) home, the slats forming the back of the closet in the room I shared were not very tight and I could easily see through them into the adjacent room - a huge bathroom where I saw four of the kids either completely or partially nude and clearly totally unconcerned about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2018 Report Share Posted November 22, 2018 On 11/19/2018 at 3:56 AM, Sed275 said: Personally I’ve been around average since I was like 15. But that was also more than 20 years ago. It seems a lot of boys/teens are developing really big really quick nowadays. Well, I was 15 about 30 years before you were, and I agree about boys'/teens' development (although, since I no longer see boys or teens naked, I can't address whether they're getting "really big"). But, while I don't have any numbers (and I'm too lazy to research them right now), isn't it a fact that the "average" height of a grown male in the 16th century was around 5 ft (or 1.5 m)? So clearly we're all getting "bigger" in general. And I believe I've read studies (again, I have no stats) that showed that puberty is slowly starting earlier and earlier in both sexes as time moves on. Hmm... I wonder, will my great great great great great great great great great great great great grandaughter's first-born son emerge weighing 30 pounds, sporting a six-inch penis with a sprinkle of pubic hair and saying, in a basso profundo voice, "Hey, Mom, what's for lunch?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike1379 Posted November 22, 2018 Report Share Posted November 22, 2018 1 hour ago, CuriousNow said: But the part of your post that intrigued me was the statement about "never encountered any bullying at that age" (those early school showers). I recently responded to @overthehillwhose experience was not like yours or mine. I am coming to the belief that you and I may have been in the minority (in that we rarely, if ever, encountered abuse in the locker rooms/showers). We boys certainly rough housed in the locker and shower rooms when were 12 or so but no one was singled out for harassment or ridicule because of his cock size. At that age the differences in size were not great anyway. But in highschool I noticed big differences in cock size in the shower room. We were always closely supervised by the gym teacher so there wasn't any fooling around or making fun of anyone. We were always pressed to finish our shower and get dressed so we could get to our next class. I saw more abuse in college, more directed at overweight boys than at boys with the smallest cocks. Red Scott 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2018 Report Share Posted November 22, 2018 @mike1379 Yes, when the showers first started for me, it was at age 12 in the sixties and, as you said, the differences in size were negligible. And, like you, while there were more differences in size/hair in high school (no boy shaved in those days), I wasn't at all interested in naked males and, even if I was, I had no time to admire my surroundings as we were given minimal time to shower and get dressed and haul a$$ to the next class. Wonder if that scheduling was intentional to keep the questionable activity down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike1379 Posted November 22, 2018 Report Share Posted November 22, 2018 (edited) @CuriousNow Well we differ a bit in that I was endlessly curious and fascinated by other boys in the shower rooms. Always had to look, even if furtively. I have no doubt our gym teacher harassed us out of the shower quickly to keep us from fooling around. Edited November 23, 2018 by RodEnuf Removed 100% quote of immediately preceding post. Red Scott 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Scott Posted November 23, 2018 Report Share Posted November 23, 2018 @Sed275 I don't believe it's more common that boys are well endowed, I just think we see more of this due to the explosion in many different forms of media. Add to that public nudity being more acceptable these days within nudist beaches etc and you have the perfect recipe for skewed belief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Scott Posted November 23, 2018 Report Share Posted November 23, 2018 @overthehill I for one will never dismiss the options or feelings of those whom "are really small" Just the same as I can't and won't dismiss those of a person who feels he's small. The two are equally destructive to one's self esteem, though I have conceded before that feeling small is much easier to overcome than "being small" with the RIGHT help. But both can be overcome as many guys on here are proof of. There's lots of "really small" guys on this site who live perfectly normal lives and have a healthy sex life too. It's all in "how we deal with our issues" We can sit and dwell on it, doing nothing, or we can actively change our view on ourselves by doing something. Biggie Smalls 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Scott Posted November 23, 2018 Report Share Posted November 23, 2018 @mike1379 in my day I think what prevented most boys commenting on another boys penis was the fear of being labelled "gay"! This was with the exception of one boy who was really well endowed, he really stood out even before puberty and was labelled a "freak" due to his size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Scott Posted November 23, 2018 Report Share Posted November 23, 2018 @mike1379 an Amen to that, I certainly had that curiosity too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.